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    Requested ICC color profile indicator

    I think that the support of ICC color profiles in version 4.10 marks a new era in our beloved IV's history: this was the missing feature for IV to become the professionals' choice for viewing images. This is why I just registered to the forum to express my gratitude.

    I think that it would be very useful to have a direct indication that an image has an embedded icc profile (apart from the increase in the time needed to view the image) and possibly its name (e.g. Adobe RGB (1998)) and other information in the future. The information could be provided via a button like the Exif and Iptc buttons.

    In addition, it would be nice if we could toggle the viewing of an image with and without using the embedded profile. This would help us e.g. check that an image we produced actually has a profile embedded so that it will print properly.

    To my knowledge there is no utility that can do the above (only Photoshop if configured to ask, will inform you that the image has a profile).

    #2
    Never heard of this ICC color profile. Which disclipine introduced this? Camera, Scanner, Software ?
    What are the items in a default content of such a profile, and how does the data represent itself?
    0.6180339887
    Rest In Peace, Sam!

    Comment


      #3
      It has to do with color consistency for printing - what we see in our monitors may be nothing like what we get from a printer. Professional artists have to get very religious about such things.
      Its: Belongs to "It"
      It's: Shortened form of "It is"
      ---------------------
      Lose: Fail to keep
      Loose: Not tight

      ---------------------
      Plurals do not require apostrophes

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        #4
        Aahh.. I see. The CMYK thing. The fundamentalists among them use a Mac of course ~~
        0.6180339887
        Rest In Peace, Sam!

        Comment


          #5
          ICC profiles are color transformation functions that are embedded in image files and associated with imaging input and output devices like monitors, scanners, printers and digital cameras. In a windows OS the profiles are .icc and .icm files that tell the OS to properly convert the image imported or exported from an application (like IV or photoshop) so that it displays correct colour.

          The proper coordination between the profiles for each of the above devices is called colour management (see e.g. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colour_management and also you can google the term).

          A lack of color management or ignoring device icc profiles leads to erroneous handling of color information, usually resulting in wrong prints, not only to an external publisher but even on your own printer. Good and modern monitor, printer and scanner drivers automatically install profiles for the devices, but one should know how to use them in various applications. If you are lucky, you may have reasonable colour results (consistency between what you see and what you get) with default settings of the OS.

          Color management is both a science and an art, and it's not only limited to the conversions between RGB and CMYK. Macs had colour management loooong before windows and this is why they still are the choice of DTP professionals.

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            #6
            I was just kidding a bit.
            Thanks for the thorough information.
            0.6180339887
            Rest In Peace, Sam!

            Comment


              #7
              (Ooops.. that was a Moderator that replied, I did not notice :-))

              Consider this: casual PC users, even amateur photographers, consciously or unconsciously, persuade themselves that they sure must be getting what they see, because they paid a hell lot of money for their quad core PC, Vista Ultimate, a fancy 12 Mpixel camera, a fancier printer and a batch of glossy papers. Alas, money never bring happiness!

              A nice visual demonstration of the problems can be found here: http://www.gballard.net/psd/go_live_...Gprofiles.html

              The tutorial is about web browsers, but the same applies to image viewers like IV. My point is that most semi-pro cameras embed colour profiles in the pictures taken and unless one is aware of the fact, he will certainly be unable to print them on his printer with accuracy: the colours won't match. He will blame the printer for this and start posting to printer support forums. In fact, printers do their job very well, provided what they receive is properly prepared by the application that prints to them.

              I have been reading about color management as a hobbyist for years, ever since I bought my first inkjet, an Epson Stylus Color II (it cost me a fortune back then). Until I realized what colour management was for, I was in a vicious circle in debugging the discrepancies between what I saw on my monitor and what I got. I slowly realised that having a monitor calibrated with Adobe Gamma is not enough. Having in addition the printer profiled is also not enough. The important thing is knowing whether an image has a profile embedded or not, and then knowing what an application does to the image both when it displays it and when it prints it. In fact, there are so many combinations that can go wrong, that knowing less usually leads to better results than a bad colour management. E.g. if unknowingly you force both the printer driver and the application to use icc profiles (this can easily happen in Photoshop and Corel), you end up with a much worse result than printing directly from the humble and always shunned Windows Picture and Fax Viewer, which was colour managed years ago.

              Therefore I believe that investing some development time in IV so that it properly hints people that their beloved pictures have or have not an embedded profile would not only have an immense educational value but also would help them resolve the well-known paradox where printing from 5 different applications leads to 5 different results on their printer, a 6th result on the print service bureau, and a 7th, 8th, etc when printed by friends and relatives on their own systems.

              Unfortunately, most users want a $29.99 solution that "lets you transfer photos from your digital camera, automatically enhance, and then print from home in just four clicks" (actual blurb from a printing utility). Such claims in most cases are blatant lies which may lead to pleasant results but never to accurate ones.

              Long post, but my point is that if I knew in the first place whether a picture has an embedded profile or not (e.g if image viewers informed me properly), I would have started learning about profiles much earlier, produced better prints, saved a lot if money in inks (!) and most important, I would have saved a lot of precious time.

              The power is in the knowledge. IrfanView now is profile aware and thus can bring truth to the masses, even when the truth is not always pleasant...

              Comment


                #8
                You made some valid points here.
                And the GBallard link is impressive.

                Btw I fancy your remark "..which may lead to pleasant results but never to accurate ones".
                The same problem appears with audio-progs claiming to clean a file from hiss or clicks in one run.
                0.6180339887
                Rest In Peace, Sam!

                Comment


                  #9
                  I second the motion. The ICC profile should be part of the info displayed when hitting the "i" key.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I looked searched in the manual (yes, Skippybox ) and couldn't find anything ... is there currently no way at all to know which colour profile IrfanView uses to display the current image ??

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Information - Exif - ColorSpace

                      Hello

                      Some times is happening when I goes to Information and open the Exif all the information are there but in ColorSpace is UNCALIBRATED (-1) .
                      If I open the same file in PS there are the name of the profile .
                      I'm using version 4.2

                      Regards
                      Jordi

                      Comment


                        #12
                        There are two possible locations for information about which ICC profile is used:

                        A) one of the marker segments in the regular JPEG stream (for example APP2)
                        B) EXIF tag

                        Normally A) takes precedence over B) but it would indeed be nice if IrfanView would display which profiles are present and which is used to display the image.

                        Originally posted by Mits View Post
                        I think that the support of ICC color profiles in version 4.10 marks a new era in our beloved IV's history: this was the missing feature for IV to become the professionals' choice for viewing images. This is why I just registered to the forum to express my gratitude.

                        I think that it would be very useful to have a direct indication that an image has an embedded icc profile (apart from the increase in the time needed to view the image) and possibly its name (e.g. Adobe RGB (1998)) and other information in the future.
                        I fully agree. I just find it weird, that there is no way to know, which profile is used. It's like a car where you switch gears but don't know which you are currently driving in ...


                        The information could be provided via a button like the Exif and Iptc buttons.
                        I think a better place is directly in the Image Properties (Image>>Information) right below the colour count.

                        In addition, it would be nice if we could toggle the viewing of an image with and without using the embedded profile. This would help us e.g. check that an image we produced actually has a profile embedded so that it will print properly.
                        Yes, it would be extremely nice to see the differences!

                        To my knowledge there is no utility that can do the above (only Photoshop if configured to ask, will inform you that the image has a profile).
                        Yes, this would be one more unique feature that only IrfanView has and noone else ... .... if implemented
                        Last edited by Frank; 05.06.2009, 10:18 PM. Reason: Merged last two posts of you!

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                          #13
                          Would be especially useful, since IV secretly converts everything to sRGB.
                          Displaying the iCC color profile would help keep track of the changes IV makes to the pictures.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by boarder's paradise View Post
                            I second the motion. The ICC profile should be part of the info displayed when hitting the "i" key.
                            It would look like this:



                            cool, no ?

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Also I second this request!

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